Issue #71: How to get horny again (!)
With Claire and Erica of 831 Stories, a modern romance fiction company.
Written by
. Edited by .Okay, confession time: I (Aja) wish my friends and I talked more about sex. (Aliza: Hard agree!)
We’re incredibly open about basically everything else: how much money we make, what we’re insecure about, the things we’re learning in therapy… But sex? It almost never comes up. My eyes went wide at dinner a few months ago when a friend who’d recently started wearing Invisalign asked, “But what do you do when you want to…?” and motioned at her mouth.
“Go to the bathroom and take them out,” said another friend casually, and the conversation quickly moved on. But I wasn’t ready.
Wait, I wanted to say. How often are you giving oral sex? And while we’re talking, how often are you having sex sex? How often does your partner initiate? How often do you? What are you trying? What did you like? What didn’t work?
There was a time when we were having these conversations constantly. Someone would disappear halfway through a night out, and the next morning, we’d meet at our favorite coffee shop (or, in Aliza’s case, the foot of each others’ beds) to debrief. Weird — or great — hook-ups spawned stories, nicknames, and inside jokes. I knew my friends’ sexual preferences, their classic moves, their disappointments, and their triumphs, and they knew mine. It was fun and liberating and intimate.
But along the way, as hook-ups turned into partners, who turned into spouses, the stories stopped. We all started to feel a little shyer. Our sex lives got less exciting, more predictable.
Claire Mazur and Erica Cerulo think romance novels can help bring the conversation — and more than that, the horniness — back.
“We’re 40 and 41. A lot of our friends have been married for a decade, have a kid or two or three, and are convinced that maybe this is just the point where their sex drive has died,” Claire explains. “Then they pick up these books and they’re like, ‘Oh, now I’m in my fucking era.’”
But let’s back up. As I told Claire and Erica three times — once in my email asking them for an interview, again when we coordinated a time to talk, and a final time when we got on the Zoom — Aliza and I are big fans. Claire and Erica have been working together since 2010, founding the beloved e-commerce site Of a Kind and eventually selling it to Bed Bath & Beyond in 2015. Their podcast, A Thing Or Two, is one we listen to every week, often trading voice notes after episodes to discuss our favorite parts. We’re also religious readers of the companion newsletter. And now Claire and Erica have launched 831 Stories, a “modern romantic fiction company” (remember those words).
Last week, 831 Stories published its debut novel, Big Fan by Alexandra Romanoff. (I finished it in a day — it was so fun and engaging yet felt authentic… and had some great sex scenes.) Aliza, Claire, Erica, and I sat down last week to talk about their new company, the accessible joy of romance — but why some women are resistant to it, female sexuality, and more.
On being initially reluctant to launch 831 Stories:
Claire: I think deep down we knew we would because we were spending so much time talking about romance novels. But we were resistant to the idea of starting a new business, because we’ve done that and we know how much sacrifice it involves.
The real aha moment came listening to an investor friend of ours talk about the manga phenomenon and how much potential he saw in it. And it was like, Sir. Sir! If you could see what they’re doing and saying online. It was a person that we had spoken to in the same breath, practically, about romance. He knew what the romance fandom was like. And for him to quickly move on and say, So I think there’s a lot in manga… We walked out of that meeting being like, Oh my god. Romance fans are comic book fans without a Marvel.
On why romance readers aren’t being served:
Erica: We know exactly why. Because romance is about women and women’s sex lives. It’s 2024, and we’re still treating romance like a niche interest, even though there are 30 million romance readers in the U.S. 50 percent of them read a book a week. Half of Americans don’t read a book a year! The way romance fans are discounted because of the content they’re consuming — which is fun, smart, thoughtful, nuanced — it pissed us off.
On getting horny (again):
Claire: I think women assume we’re just not as horny creatures as men. I’m not a scientist. I’m not a biologist. But I do know that men are sexually stimulated from the minute they open their eyes in the morning, because that is how the world is designed.
Women often discover these books at a stage in their life where they’re not having as many opportunities for arousal, because they’re busy and mired in the muck of life. It’s exciting to be like, Oh, my sex drive still exists; I just needed something to turn it on a little bit.
The sexual dynamics in romance are such an important and progressive part of the genre and something that got us really excited from a cultural perspective. We just don’t have that much sex entertainment or content that is written by and for women.
On talking more openly about sex with friends:
Claire: [Reading romance] has definitely helped us do this — and we’ve heard about it anecdotally, too.
On launching a “romantic fiction” company instead of a “publishing” one:
Erica: We want the books to be the foundation. The genre lives and dies by the books that the fans are reading and passing around and recommending. But the thing that makes it really fun is how you can extend the stories — building out all of these ways for people to stay and play in the world.
For example, Big Fan is about a political strategist, Maya, who falls in love with her childhood boy band crush, Charlie Blake. We commissioned someone to write and produce Charlie's single. (Aja’s note: On Spotify, the artist is “Charlie Blake,” for an extra dose of realism!) We commissioned the fan club t-shirt Maya gives Charlie in the book with an illustration by Naomi Otsu, an illustrator we love, as well as a necklace from Lizzie Fortunato jewels that Charlie gives Maya.
On the resistance to reading romance:
Claire: We’re all progressive women who think they recognize [things like internalized misogyny]. And yet we still have so many friends or peers who are like, Not romance books though. These are the same friends who watched Bridgerton and All The Boys I Loved Before and are obsessed with Normal People. It’s really mesmerizing to have the conversation with someone and watch them question themselves — Oh, that actually is a problem or a blind spot for me.
On where romance-curious readers should start (after Big Fan, obviously):
Erica: I have a couple friends who say Seven Days in June by Tia Williams did it for them. Yuling Kuang’s How to End a Love Story does a very nice and complicated job of dealing with grief… but in a second chance romance, forced proximity high school loves way. And we’re obsessed with Tessa Bailey. She is such a gift — someone who teaches people that books can be fun and entertaining and more delightful than whatever TV show you were going to put on.
On the predictability yet progressiveness of romance:
Claire: Part of what we really love about the genre is that it is deeply formulaic. In the technical sense, it’s not a true romance unless it has a happily ever after. A meet-cute. A will-they-or-won't-they (and they will!) But because it is so formulaic, the author has a lot of freedom to experiment. Readers know and trust that you are going to take them to a certain place, so they’re also willing to go somewhere pretty far afield. A lot of contemporary romance authors are doing really progressive, interesting, experimental stuff that you might not expect in romance.
Are you sold? We certainly are.
Despite never being a romance reader, a few hours later Aliza texted me from the romance aisle of our local bookstore, asking which book she should buy first. We both decided to read Chase Me by Tessa Bailey, at Claire and Erica’s recommendation. And we’re thinking about hosting a “romance book club for non-romance readers” to discuss! Boston-area readers, let us know if you’d be interested…
And ICYMI…
The most popular link from Monday’s issue featuring novelist
was this bonkers zebra inflatable. Check out the full site, just for fun.
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I (Aja) wish my friends and I talked more about sex.
May I venture a guess why?
For a younger single woman sex is about herself and finding what is pleasing to her. There can be lots of excitement and experimentation, this is entertaining to talk about!
In an older married woman, sex is more about the relationship and the couple. It’s intimate and doesn’t just belong to her. Pair that with the fact that years of experience has taught her EXACTLY what she likes and well, maybe that’s not very exciting to hear about over and over again.
I’m 45 and have a strong sex drive and a great sex life but don’t talk about it because a) it’s between my husband and me and b) frankly wouldn’t be that exciting to a listener.
One of my fave smart romances is Eligible by Curtis Sittenfeld - a modern retelling of Pride and Prejudice. I love Annabel Monaghan's books too - which I think of as "romance for moms!"